0:06  
All right. Okay, attendees are floating. And that means we know it is working. Zoom has been acting up for some folks today, but not for us. I am excited, folks, this is Tim Sarrantonio of neon one, we have a fantastic panel discussion for you today. We're going to start that up. Very shortly. We had a lot of folks registered for today. So I want to make sure that we give people time. So I'll go over some basic items here. I guess housekeeping is what what we universally call that? I don't know necessarily why, by the way, but like, we can get into that you. You can interact with my banter right now, folks, if you want so audio stopped. Can I get a confirmation, by the way on on for my team as well as anybody else who's who's listening that you can hear me?

1:07  
I can hear you. Well, audio is

1:09  
working fine. Okay. And I do housekeeping by the way. Somebody said it's because I don't do housekeeping har har. Oh, Cam? Oh, it's Kim. I have an interview with Kim later we're going to talk about that. Okay, so we're gonna get up starting about formally in a minute. Okay. Thank you everyone for confirming that the audio is good, man. Thank you very much. So I didn't mean to be that be our test of the chat feature. So I'm going to do that formally. Now we're going to do some quick introductions. And then we'll get into some of the kind of basic structure

1:46  
And then we'll get into some of the kind of basic structure of what we're going to be doing today. And then we're going to get into it. So first, I'll start with some introductions. And then I'd love to hear from the crowd. Well, I'll give you a prompt question there. My name is Tim Sarrantonio. I'm director of corporate brand at NEON one. I'll be the facilitator of today's presentation. I might chime in. But I'm really more interested in hearing from our two panelists. So I'm gonna go I'm gonna Tetris this for my perspective. So Mallory, I'm gonna start with you. And then Suhailah I'm gonna go with you. But Mallory, can you introduce yourself to the crowd? Yes. Thanks for having me, Tim. My name is Mallory Erickson. I'm the creator of the power partners formula and host of the podcast what the fundraising and I really fused together fundraising strategy with Executive Coaching Habit and behavior design and design thinking principles. And obviously, all of that touches technology in our technology decisions in so many different ways. So I'm really excited to be having this conversation with Suhailah and Tim today. So thank you for having me. Awesome. Suhaila. Awesome. My name is Suhailah, Wahid, and I am an African American Black Muslim woman. I'm currently wearing a gold scarf on my head with a green jacket. And I use she her pronouns. I am the founder and CEO of giving geeks and which is a digital fundraising agency that supports organizations and building better connections with nonprofits in building sustainable revenue sources. And so I'm super excited to be here today.

3:17  
If you've ever been able to have a conversation with me, I've somehow drawn into a conversation, a conversation about technology in some way, shape, or form. So I'm looking forward to having a good talk with the team today.

3:29  
Thank you for the accessibility check. So I am Tim. I use he him pronouns. And I am wearing a neon one black hat and a kick ass shirt that shows a bear in a few different areas in the woods. Basically, it's kind of hard to describe in all honesty, Mallory, let's take it back to you for a little bit of an accessibility.

3:51  
Yes, I'm Mallory, Erickson. My pronouns are she and her. And I am not wearing anything on my head. But I have brown curly hair, and I'm wearing a black dress.

4:03  
Okay, very cool. So what we're going to be doing over the next, I would say 56 minutes now, is we're going to have a conversation about technology and nonprofits. So that's kind of the basic, that's the the realm that we're going to work in. The way it's going to work is that the we have some prompt questions that that we've generated, that are going to touch on a few different elements around accessibility, around Dei, around questioning the phrase, we've always done it this way. But we're ultimately going to bring it back to that Northstar of how can can nonprofits and especially small shop nonprofits understand the role of technology in their operations. Now from there, we can go a lot of different ways. This is where you folks come in. So for anybody who's attending live, I would love for you to type in who you are.

and kind of, let's just go simply with location, because that's one of the fascinating things about technology is that we can see people all over the place. So type into the chat where you are physically, mentally to if you want to do that as well. And, and we can go from that we have Toronto so we're already international when it comes to this because I'm based in upstate New York, Mallory, you're over in in Where are you right now? I'm in Berkeley, California. And Suhailah actually, you you I have to check each time where you are because you travel sometimes. So where are you right now?

5:38  
So I am in Raleigh, North Carolina.

5:40  
Okay, you're in currently.

5:41  
Okay. I literally just left Texas like to like a week ago. So

5:46  
this is why I can't assume because I would have went with Texas. So okay, we have Brazil, we have Jacksonville, Florida. We got New Jersey. We got Cape Cod, awesome. Kansas City. Hey, we're gonna be there next week for the NEOs Summit. Me and Mallory actually, we got Texas, we got love it love it, people are loving the green wall. So this is fun like this is the power of technology is that we can all connect in different time zones in different countries. That's a benefit, in my opinion. Now, we also want you to make this interactive, if you have a burning question that either comes up when you're hearing us talk or that you do want to talk about use the Q and A feature. So chat is great if you want to throw a comment. But q&a ensures that we can see it. So as Suhailah has shown we can interact with you and chat with you. And we would love to do that. But if we're deep in conversation, you want to make sure that we see something I will be facilitating the q&a and paying attention to that this is being recorded. And for accessibility, we have the live captions on right now that are being provided by zoom. So they're not 100%. But we'd like to ensure we do that. And the transcript will be provided there are no slides. There is no takeaway, other than the mental takeaways that you will have today. So I want to kind of start, let's kick it off. Let's go who's ready to go? Who's ready to go? Let's see that chat. Who's ready? Me All right. There we go. Exclamation point me. Okay. Well, Mallory, and the webinars is done it so the least we're ready. So thank you, Stacey. Thank you, Erica. So obviously, I have been at a tech company for for coming up in November for 11 years. Before that, I worked in the nonprofit space. And and my background is not in technology I went to school for for all intents and purposes, humanities. And so I didn't get a tech degree, my my introduction to technology was, it's a thing that might help me figure out how to fundraise. And the reason that I wanted to bring this panel in particular together is because I think both of you uniquely see and hear the power as well as the concerns and issues that that technology can open up. So I'm going to start with our first question and Suhailah I'm actually going to kick it over to you, which is what do you see is the current state of technology. Right now? I don't even like saying post pandemic world. But let's say since March 2020, we've had a lot of things change. What what's the current state as you see it?

8:39  
Yeah, I would say the first thing that comes to mind is like just a cutesy and simple answer, which is like the current state is our state right? technology right now, is it may not necessarily be everything we we want it to be, but it has the potential to be everyone has influence as to how technology works with us. And so first things first, I have to say is that, you know, in this space, we the people have a significant amount of control, and what we want to see in front of us, and I think that we should know that firsthand before we drift off into what other people are influencing us with with technology. So that's the first thing. So the second thing is that, you know, I see, you know, as it relates to nonprofits, they understand and I recognize that technology is extremely essential and critical for their own success. And one of the things I you know, always hope for is that nonprofits are also utilizing technology as a long term strategy to grow their organizations in their impact. And for some organizations that I work with, you know, this is this is front and center. And you know, for some it's just a long term conversation where we're trying to get into that that direction and get into that road. roadmapping effort of making sure that the state of their technology aligns with their current mission, vision and values. And so for me, establishing a, a tech plan to correlate with what you have going on right now in your in your organization is extremely essential. And nonetheless, I don't think that in any way shape or form technology is is going to stop growing, it's going to be changing all the time. We see constant conversations right now just in when when we're kind of scrolling through Instagram about how we're handling algorithm issues. And, and people are talking directly to CEOs about what they want to see on that app, and applying pressure where it's necessary. And so for me, the first, the most important thing, as it relates to the current state of technology is that we need to be more aware of, of getting what we need out of these platforms, as the organizations that serve the communities directly, we need to be a part of the voices that are changing the algorithms that you know, to match up with making sure that we have a lot more positivity in these spaces. We need to make sure that when we're talking with CRMs, platforms, and donor management systems, that we're communicating the barriers that we're experiencing, while utilizing their technology. And for a lot of us, you know, we may be short staffed, or a lot of us, you know, we're trying to implement programming into our technology, not just fundraising. And so, I think that since whenever you're looking at how you want to utilize technology center the need of your community directly. And don't be afraid to ask for what you need, we're in a space where it's, it's a, it's a lot easier to do so than we may have been 15 years ago. And so right now, technology is yours to to hold and to push and to train to be better for your community members.

12:01  
How do we even want to define technology in this? In this case, actually, because the Wikipedia just pulled it up? That's not gonna be helpful here. So like, what should we because because a lot of times one, folks, if you think this is going to be some sneaky, and we're going to talk about neon, no, that's not today. That's not what's happening here. That's boring. But a lot of times when people in our space, I feel they reduce it down to Oh, you're talking about the CRM, right and CRM is important. But let's actually even take one step back, and this is going to be kind of open ended, so Haleigh, if you want to take it run with Mallory, you want to take it over. But what do we even want to define it in this conversation today, let's say.

12:44  
So immediately, you know, my mind goes to what I previously talked about is that, you know, technology is is the system in which you're utilizing to garner attention for your calls and your mission. And that can include CRM systems, and donor management systems can also include social media, that can also include grant management systems, that you're you're utilizing and needing to connect with to, you know, grow your campaigns or things like that. And so, for me, it is how you're connecting digitally, to external audiences to bring awareness to what you all have going on. And as well as potentially organizing your organization, your operations, things like that. So there's an external and an internal, you know, perspective that you can have when it comes to technology. And your external technology is generally like, you know, your social media platforms, things like that. And your internal technology is where you're kind of keeping things organized, you're utilizing your operation methods, with different platforms to make sure that your teams are communicating and collaborating in an efficient manner.

13:56  
And I like Kim, who's a member of her connected fundraising community, I'm actually going to be interviewing her for generosity exchange, our virtual conference, that's in October, she's going to be talking about her usage of visualization and Google Data Studio. Her definition here is technology is any tool that you use tooling that you use to perform work. She gives examples of case management, class management, Chromebooks for clients to check out things like that. So I think there's an alignment for what you just defined to but Mallory any kind of perspective, or deferring or augmentation on that definition. And then we know,

14:33  
I agree with everything that Suhailah said, and I and to second what Kim said, I think for the purposes of this conversation, we're talking about digital tools, in particular, because I've heard the terminology technology used for non digital tools, actually, when we think about sort of like ancient technologies. But I think for the purposes of this conversation, we're talking particularly about digital tools that help nonprofits do that front facing work and back end work. Okay,

15:00  
very cool. So one of the things, Mallory that I want to ask you is, especially because you're so good at identifying kind of these base fears that people might have, what role does it play? In not only overcoming fear, but building that base of support for organization? In your opinion?

15:26  
Yeah, well, so there's like the the fear elements of, of technology, adoption, right, and all the things that go into that. And I think to build off of just for a second what Taylor was saying before around sort of the current state of technology, I think one of the big challenges that we have is that while there's been so much growth in terms of technology, resources and innovation available to nonprofits, and I totally agree with the framework of sort of putting nonprofits in more of the like offense, seek to identify what they want, and what they need, and then finding the right tools for them, instead of letting the technology tell them what they need and what they need to be changing. But I think one of the one of the big missing pieces. And so this sort of rolls into your question, Tim, is that I think we think about the adoption of the technology as the hard part. And then once we've made the decision to start that technology, we don't build in a lot of support framework time to actually implement it. And I think what ends up happening, I mean, nonprofit leaders are the busiest people I know. And I remember this from my like, when I was an IDI of a small, you know, a pretty small organization to that, there was so much energy I had to put into the decision making, and getting everyone on board and getting the board's approval and getting all my staff to agree that like the moment I signed the tech contract, I felt like I was like done. And the reality is, I was just it was just starting. And so I think, you know, there's like, there's the fear piece, I think around that I feel like it's more fear around the adoption. And then frankly, I think after the decision making, what happens is a little bit of like this sort of kick back that like, now we got the technology, it should solve the day. And there's actually still a huge human team management component to utilizing that tool on a daily basis, building habits around it, making sure that those tools are integrated into your systems and processes, and that you're constantly reinforcing their usage. And I just don't think like, there's so much potential with the ways technology can sort of save us time and a development office and to your to your piece around, like, how does it build our support network, I mean, the reality is, technology can serve as almost like an additional development person inside your organization. But in order for it to do that, you have to have the time to optimize the system. And in order to make the time to optimize the system, you need to prioritize some things inside your current shop, until the technology is really going to be able to build the capacity, you're hoping it will. So that was a lot. But no, no.

18:13  
Can I absolutely, I'm so glad you said that Mallory, because what are the things that when I'm working with organizations, one of the things that I asked them to do is to ask them to allow me to facilitate a space where we really think about the long term vision and strategy of technology, because a lot of organizations like you said, sign that contract, they may get some upload, and they're like, Yeah, we're out peace, you know, and I always this is, this is my analogy, so just work with me here. But I'm always like, you know, coming closer, because what I what I don't want you all to do, what I don't want any organization to do is allow their, their, the technology that they're utilizing, that has the potential to be so extremely helpful, kind of be that uncle that sleeping on the couch. And you know, when you go to try to turn off the TV, he's like, I'm still watching that like, and he just, you know, falls back asleep. And you have this like this, this continuous Sleeping Giant here, you know, that you've paid for that you've invested in, that you're not utilizing. And in turn, what what we should be driving towards is including how we're going to be utilizing that technology in our strategy. So I love that you said that.

19:27  
We have a great question. I want to I want to get to Andrea's question shortly because it deals with automation but lack of losing authenticity. It's so juicy I want to hold on and Andrew, don't worry, don't worry, we're gonna get there. And the thing is, is that like, like what I'd love for us, like our charge today is is a lot of times these conversations and this group, I am not worried about it. I want to make sure that there's some actionable advice that people can take From this, because a lot of times we hear these kinds of I just came from a conference, for instance. And there was a lot of like talking of technology. And, and a lot of times, especially for small shop nonprofits, they hear these conversations, and it's very framed and what I'm starting to call 3% content, which is that it pertains to nonprofits with $5 million, and more, which is only 3% of the nonprofits out there. And then the 97% out there are like, What am I supposed to do with this information, which kind of gets to a little bit to Andrea's, but like NPSL. So I do want to say Kim, says NPOs, need to recognize that this is a journey, and they should continue to evolve their tooling over time. What's right today, we may not be right, three years from now. So I think this gets into larger strategic planning. So how can organizations I'm going to kind of throw this out? Generally, how can organizations approach this, because something I've learned probably over the last few years, especially is that the word integration can be very loaded. And there's loaded in the sales process. So here's my tip, folks, if somebody says that the CSV import is your integration, watch out, because that means you're doing a lot more work if they say, Oh, we integrate with that how? Import Export. Now, there's certain technologies that can help streamline that I know, we have my friend Christine from Z bend here that that's perfectly fine when it comes to that. But integration also has another term and another application, which is integration of process. So from a strategic planning standpoint, if we're thinking three years in the future, or even one year in the future, how can people approach technologies integration into your planning? And then I think that'll naturally lead into Andrea's question, actually. And we do have more, we have other questions. So I'll view those while you folks dive into that one. In terms of strategic planning, I am throwing it out there.

22:10  
So I want to start

22:12  
Yeah, go ahead and start. So one of the things that I have done in the past with organizations is that when we, when we're looking at the strategic plan, and we are, in my case, kind of setting a goal as it relates to fundraising, and development. You know, we generally have like a certain percentage that we're trying to increase and in and reach within the next three years, or is that in a third? And sometimes that involves increased staff members, and sometimes it doesn't. And so one of the things that I always ask is that, you know, when planning out for our technology, and after we've identified our financial goals that that we respect, and that we're excited about, and that we're, you know, pushing towards, we also take a look at how we're how much time we have to make certain changes to the technology that we're utilizing, and we're bringing in, and how that will directly impact our ROI. Our donor retention numbers are our potential for donor acquisition. And so for me, it means this, the simplest way that I can, you know, offer solid advice here is just to take this time to say year over year, what are we looking at doing with our donor management system? And how does it connect to our donor acquisition goals. And so for example, that might mean that if we've got a really crummy newsletter list that we've been kind of working off of, for however long that, you know, by the, by the end of this year, we have, we wouldn't have liked to not only strengthen that list with new names and things like that, and all that beautiful stuff, but that we know exactly who we're reaching out to. We've segmented these lists in an in an appropriate manner. And then that kind of leads us into communication and making sure that we are not only just reaching out to them for, you know, fundraising campaigns when we're segmenting them in the appropriate manner. And so the way we do that is by utilizing the technology and so we'll get we'll break down the tools that the technology kit may offer and say that this is when we'd like to implement this tool at this time. And we set certain goals around those tools to make sure that we are utilizing that Sleeping Giant as much as possible. And so when I get to work with Oregon,

24:41  
how big is your uncle in this?

24:45  
Well, you know, I have I have like a six foot eight uncle so pretty much

24:50  
Sleeping Giants.

24:53  
Right? He acts just like a giant.

24:56  
So I digress. Sorry, I'm throwing

24:58  
so so Um, I literally, it may seem, I literally go to the platform that the organization is using, I go look at their tools. And I try to figure out which of these tools aligns best with the specific goals that we have. And we may choose one, two or three of them, depending on the capacity and the time that we have to give to the strategic planning and to get to these goals. And I tried to create a plan to say, okay, month over month, this is how we're you how we're interested in using this specific tool, like be a segmenting, or something else, you know, so, you know, I or, you know, some organisms, some platforms even have features where you can kind of do wealth insights with, you know, the donors that you have, and I feel like, Okay, at this point in time, during the year, we're going to do a circulation of wealth insights to kind of see where our donor base is. And so to me, that is how we really dig deep into utilizing the technology in the best way. But that requires planning ahead of time. Mallory

26:02  
Yeah, yeah, I'm going to try to answer this one. Andrea's and Andrews question,

26:07  
whoa. Whoa, all right. Let's try myself on mute. Let's roll.

26:17  
So okay, so I think because when I'm thinking about so I love everything that you just said, and I think to even maybe help folks take a step back, I would think about your fundraising processes, the different activities that you're doing on a daily, weekly, monthly, annual basis when it comes to fundraising. And I would try to identify like, where the biggest pain points and roadblocks are, like where in each of those processes are you spending a lot of time and really feel like you're wasting a lot of time when there might be a tool or a system that could that could help you. And you do not need to know what that tool or system is, I think sometimes we sit down with the few tools that we know about. And we try to figure out where we can plug and play those into our processes, I would actually recommend that people take an additional step back and really look at where are the pain points inside your organization across a number of different processes. A strategy to do this Andrew that helps to build buy in is that when you're doing this practice, in this process, you can have different people on your team try to solve different problems from the perspective of a different person on the team. So the EDI does it. From the perspective of the program director, the program director does it from the perspective of the development director, the development director does it from the perspective of the IDI, it starts to help people shift their perspectives and, and start to see all of the different ways that your behaviors and your habits are interconnected in ways that lead to everyone's success. That's something I do earlier on in the process that leads to buy in later on down the line. The other piece to that I think, and this will happen if you take a deeper look at the processes and the pain points, is to really give people the space to say, like what's really hard for them? And what and where do they have fear around change, I think we need to understand that change is scary. Our lizard brains do not like when we do things that are not predictable, that we have not done before. Uncertainty, biologically is scary for us. And so sometimes your staff and your team is going to say we want that system, and then you're going to still feel resistance with implementation. And you're gonna be like, like you said, you wanna have it, you guys, that's normal. It's normal to cognitively want something to understand the reason why people want to see a tech implementation and to still feel fear and discomfort and resistance around implementing it. So my number one, my number one strategy for that. And I do a lot of work around this. And actually at NEON ones generosity exchange last year, this is what I talked about, which was habit design. One of the biggest ways to help your team members overcome that resistance and those fears is to design habits that help them take action on something that they feel that discomfort around and I use Dr. BJ Fogg behavior model and talk about how can you always make the action easier to do. So you're having trouble with implementation like people using your CRM system, okay, set a goal for the week around logins, how many times you want them to log in three times, you're going to check that at the end of the week, you're going to celebrate it you're going to show people shine around logging in nothing else. No other goals make the action as easy as possible to do and you build habits over time. But you need to know sort of where you're going, what pain points you're solving in your process. And then on the implementation side, be ready to talk about the fear and design habits and just get People that space to sort of build new ways of operating. And then I'll just say one quick thing about Andrea's question, which is that piece around, do we automate too much where we lose that authenticity, we should all be communicating with our donors more. So when I think about what you're automating, it's not so that you're doing less personal things. It's so that it gives you the capacity to do more personal things, you're automating the things that can be automated in your stewardship, so that you can do more things in your stewardship that are unique, or leveraging different peak moments. And I think there are ways also to really build authenticity into automation. I do not think those things are binary or are or in conflict, but you have to find your voice through those different touchpoints. And let the personality of the organization and have you really be able to be written in to that email that people are going to get, you know, two weeks after they gave their gift, just checking in around something you can do that. And I think we often think about that as a binary relationship. And, and I don't, and I don't think it is at all.

31:13  
And just to because zoom permissions for who sees what are just wonky, so to kind of make sure that everybody knows the questions that Andrea and Andrew asked, Are we overusing technology, specifically in stewardship with automated emails and the like that we're losing authenticity. So that's what we just covered there. And Andrew asked, How do you teach and coach and encourage folks who are not as tech savvy to welcome technology with open arms. So we'll make sure to make sure to kind of read out the questions fully. One thing that I want to point out that we've experienced here internally, right, is we found that the organizations that were most likely to cancel with us, the the SAS term is turn. Were the ones that didn't by implementation. And the ones that kind of said, we're going to skip over this or it's too expensive or stuff like that. So we stepped back and we said, how can we make sure that everybody has a good experience? And we actually were rolling out in October, a new onboarding thing, because we brought in, like, Dr. Tony, Dr. Tony is an absolute genius for curriculum design. And she looked at it because we started actually hiring curriculum specialists. And the very first course that you're taking is, what the hell did I just buy? And what is my goal for it? Like, that's how we revised it. Because before we're like, you're ready to import? And we'd find that people are like, import what? Like, what am I doing? Where am I supposed to get it? So literally, it's like, here's your worksheet. Define your goals, conduct research, involve stakeholders, that's lesson three, like literally, we're teaching people like, and then send it to us. So we know what you're doing right? And then let's have a call. And so we were pretty excited about that. But the reason we did it is those pain points, because your technology vendors should be paying attention to this type of stuff, you shouldn't have to do all of this to like, you have to be part of it. But like, just because and that gets us into some of the other questions that I want to ask, which is the accessibility of this, the affordability of this and how to shift toward an abundance mindset with our technology, because I think that there's so many things that I've started calling them digital Pied Pipers, where it's like, come here, and we will solve your problems. And and I'm getting worried where cheap is equated with nonprofit free is equated with nonprofit. And I don't think I think there's a big difference between affordability and sheep. So Mallory, I want to kick this over to you. First, how do we approach this with an abundance mindset? And then I and then we can Suhaila I'll kick it over to you to kind of see where we can expand on that.

34:10  
Yeah, I mean, first, I just want to say that it's really hard, and to just sort of validate for folks that it can be really hard to access an abundance mindset inside this sector where there's so much rooted in scarcity. And so I think, you know, so one to just sort of have some sort of like compassion and space for yourself. If you're like, God, that word feels really inaccessible to me right now. Like, that's okay. I think that that is really normal. And one of the ways that I help sort of shift the way an organization is maybe thinking about their investment in technology, is to think about, you know what, so I have people calculate, and I should have brought that slide, but I can figure out a way to share with you guys later but I have people calculate kind of how much they're raising per hour in their fundraising. So this is kind of this is not that difficult of a calculation, basically, you take how much you're raising on an annual basis, you divide it by, like, if you're one person shop the number of hours, you feel like you're spending a week, fundraising times that by 48, this is not perfect math, this is to give you a rough estimate of around how much per hour you need to be raising, on average, to hit your goals, right? And then you're going to see, and it's probably going to come somewhere between like $200, now we're in $1,000 an hour depending on your organization, your organization size, and what your donor data and what your donor database looks like. And then if you think about, okay, if I had a technology that solved this thing, five of those hours a week are spent on this thing. And actually, technology can do that thing. So if you were able to shave $5.05 hours a week off of your hourly rate. So if you only needed 15 hours a week to raise that annual budget, because the technology did the rest, how much does that save? And how much does that mean, you're raising? And then as the technology cheaper than that, usually the answer is like a resounding yes. Because I think one of the things we look at a lot in technology, and you're right, and there's a lot of marketing around, you know, like, is this the cheapest thing that I can get for my money? And I do this God, I remember as an executive director, just like, what's my cheapest option for this? And that just really, really restricted what was possible. And for like, $1,000 difference, $2,000 difference, I could have had something that was like, exactly what I wanted. And I never spent the time to really think about that. And to think about the implications about of that. And I think we can find the money in our budgets. I mean, the reality is that organizations who shift their understanding, I'm not saying you need to buy a $50,000 technology instead of a free technology. But there's so much accessible in this middle range. And I think when we just do that race to the bottom, and we just like ask, is this free? We're not We're not approaching the problem, even like Suhailah was saying at the beginning from like, what do we need, like, what is our community need, and really centering our needs in that conversation? I think that's really where the abundances is like prioritizing our needs and figuring out who and what solves it. So Helen,

37:37  
thank you, Mallory. I think that was everything that you said explains that the so far has been really dope. It to me, it also kind of leads us into something that Timex has previously about, you know, how do we combat some of these, these long held truths about technology. And I like to talk about some of what you just stated, and then go into answering one of these, one of the questions that was posted. You know, I've had, I've run into instances where we've had some organizations and or donors that have been scared about using their funding to support technology, right. And first of all, we start off with the fact that when, when done appropriately and efficiently, technology does build capacity for organizations to serve their community hard stop, right. And if we are funding the tools to support our team members, not there's, there's so many, you know, additional benefits to that, not only does it help us improve our infrastructure, our processes, our operations, and ultimately, our beneficiaries, but it also helps us keep our teams, you know, sometimes in place, because they may feel supported by the systems that we are putting that we are investing in to make sure that we're not stretching them too thin. And, you know, I think it's, it's, it's one thing to go get this technology to say, Okay, we're going to, we're going to get the CRM and we're going to just hand it over to our development director, and they're going to be able to run off with it. And we're not taking into account all of the other things that that director has has on their plate, that they may not have the time to integrate this system in the most efficient manner when if we had paid a little a little bit more, or if we had, you know, potentially gone and got a grant that might have supported covering the cost of having someone come in and implement the system for us and teach the team how to resolve some of those pain points. You know, we can alleviate the issue of of of overwhelming our staff members, you know, overwhelming our volunteers with things that we could have solved at the top, you know, of integrating any system. And so, you know, I think it comes down to how we, how intentional we are about caring for our team members. And, you know, if we if we recognize that we want to have an abundance of funding, you know, and we found some source, some source of funding to cover the cost of the technology, I would also consider how much it would take, you know, to have someone come in and make sure that we're all set up and ready to go. And how we plan on using this technology in the long term. It to me, that comes down to just mitigating risks. You know, that's all that comes down to. Do you want do we want to go ahead and answer one of these questions, too,

40:53  
I just wanted to kind of put out one thing that's related to that we've been looking at that very question and kind of that struggle around affordability for people. And one of the long held truths, for instance, in the nonprofit sector is that CRMs charge by licenses, or by donor accounts. And we said, Why, like on our end, and what's hard about this is that a lot of nonprofits, they don't understand that these conversations are happening, they have no control over these types of conversations. And the way that it shouldn't be happening is that you have to go talk to nonprofits. And what we kept hearing over and over and over is, I'm trying to acquire new donors, and then I'm gonna, like get charged more for trying to actually find new people to support my mission, or we always got to ask the question, What about emails? Right, we got an email, we got a question that that. Andrew, I want to get into the logistics, I don't know if we'll really get into email open rates today, we'll try but like, that type of question is hard to answer if you're cutting and deleting donors, because you're gonna go over your your limit. So earlier this month, we changed it, we're pegging it to revenue. Now, what's the organization's revenue size, not how much they raised? We don't care. That's not ethical. It's more like if you're under a million bucks, or if you're under $250,000, or you're over 5 million. This is what it costs. So I think that there's different ways that we can approach it. And it has to be done by listening to folks like you, and to listening to what the market actually needs to and 97% of the market is struggling right now when you get down to it. So do we want to kind of field, we have one question from Nan, for instance. So we can kind of go into some of these more tactical items in our last 15 minutes. I do though, think it's important to touch on. I actually I'll ask this, and then we'll shift into maybe more tactical items. All of this, on its surface seems like it's the same question that everybody's dealing with. But the reality is, is that there are inequities that play into this as well. Where African American organizations, for instance, have a lot harder time attracting individual donors or obtaining relationships with these types of funding sources to open this type of stuff forward. So but as a SAS vendor, Kim, is another reason why we did that to Kim is right. So yes, that's not my problem, your problem, my space, holding fees, so good on us. So thank you. So what I want to ask, though, is the role that diversity, equity and inclusion planning and strategic thinking plays in this from an organizational standpoint? Not you know, how can we think about the roles that technology plays when it comes to all the different intersectional nuances that play out in society today, when it comes to technology, right, like even well, screening, I'll use that as an example. There's biases when it comes to wives spell screening based off of zip codes, right. So how do we approach it? It's kind of a big question, but I'm gonna kind of lay it out there. We can go in any direction that we want on it, though.

44:22  
Yeah, that's a that's a really huge question. And

44:25  
it's to me it needs its own webinar, but like, yeah, 100%.

44:29  
And to me, it kind of goes back to that community first conversation that we've we've been having. And there there is no resolution without communicating with the community directly with some what some of the issues are, that they are running into. And the funny thing is, we don't even have to, we don't necessarily have to look too far all we have to do is listen, all we have to do is hear them out and, and recognize that, you know, their, their experience is an example for us as to how you know some of what some of the changes are that we need to make. And I remember when we were having this conversation online about, you know how CRMs charge and you know how, how well we should be changing and moving forward as a sector. And so for me, you know, whenever I think about how to support organizations, and consideration of technology and things like that, I think it's up to us to offer when we know that there's an issue and a problem, it's up to us to offer a different resource or a different, a different viewpoint, right. And so number one, the way that, you know, neon one is looking at changing its pricing structure is is truly innovative, and thoughtful. And it also reminds me of how, you know, I've had conversations even about like compensation, where we get into discussions of centering our compensation around the systemic barriers that individuals are experiencing. And so I kind of think that, when we're looking at approaching any issue that any specific group may be experiencing, as it relates to technology, each of these, each of these companies is going to have to have some long, hard conversations and truths about what they're doing that also contribute to these barriers, strengthening these barriers in front of these communities. And, you know, when I originally thought about this question as well, I definitely thought about it as how we were representing ourselves as the organization. But I'm glad I'm looking forward to kind of seeing how, how we changed the structure of representation in the technology platforms itself. And I think that it is important to uplift some of these orgs, like, I've seen a couple platforms where, you know, they are contributing to the organizations that are suffering currently. They're making sure to highlight them through their communications and talk about their experiences, utilizing their platforms so that we can kind of share and collaborate and bring our issues to the forefront. So I really want to, to me, the first thing is just to go community first, I guess, just to kind of dumb it down.

47:31  
Yeah, well, and that's why listening is important. So even now that I reread Kim's question, I don't want to get too far off. But like kitten statement, there's nuances when it comes to even budgeting, right? Like, we can't look at the same budget of an organization that has a ton of program fees that have nothing to do with our CRM and charge people for that. So that has taken been taken into account. Right? So you have to listen, and think about things when it comes to like individual giving versus program fees, case management, and all this type of stuff. But when you get down to the the involvement of community, I think that's that's something that a lot of companies in our realm, I would make an argument they don't know how to do.

48:14  
Yeah. And you know, what's interesting is, I think we've had this conversation a couple of times to when we even talked about the way, the way the alternative payment methods that platforms are offering, you know, yeah, those are, you kind of have to think about sometimes how certain communities are receiving funds, and how we're, how we're adapting to the way that they receive funds and the way that they're able to track that in their systems. And so whenever, whenever we're looking at the budget, whenever we're deciding on a, on a platform and whatnot, not only what we can afford, we also have to connect with the culture of giving, for that organization for that community directly. And how that will impact the system that they select. And so, you know, neon one does have a really good to tell me the name of the tool, Tim, it's essentially where we can kind of look at some of the different factors that go into giving, depending on where you live and the type of organization that you're,

49:15  
oh, our data impact dashboard. Yeah, so that's, that's, yeah, so that's, like a free resource that we put out. And I think that's important, too, to like, point out that there's not a lot of transparency on data when it comes to this type of thing. And, and there's such a, like, fear by vendors, that if they share their like, secrets, that like, you're gonna get screwed, right? And I'm just like, I just don't believe in that personally. And, and so, you know, and again, like, this is not just a US thing, Fundraising Effectiveness Project has Bloomerang and Donor Perfect and Keela that want to share that type of data, but like geography, Mission revenue, like stuff like It's extremely difficult to get this public information, right. And even like some of the vendors, I was talking to somebody that deals with like stocks and stuff, and they didn't even know what mutual aid was right. So like, are they going to be programming their their distribution to make it easy for like community based organizations to do it? Probably not. Right. So there's an education on both sides here. But Mallory, I want to make sure that you you have some say in here, and then we're going to kind of just open it up and I do want to make sure we talked to Nan's question, by the way. Yep.

50:35  
Oh, you think you're on mute? Oh, no,

50:37  
sorry, sorry, no, I'm hearing, I'm here, just saving everyone from having to hear me cough, am I, you know, I'm not a DI educator. But I'll say that the thing that I have heard a lot from black and brown fundraisers in particular is how they like anecdotally is the lack of support, they feel like they're given around the tech adoption that they're advocating for. And so the other thing I would just say, like for, you know, for leaders in particular, around empowering your staff, and, you know, I've heard anecdotally, again, so many times about how black and back brown fundraisers in our sector feel like they're given portfolios, bigger portfolios with less support. And I just think like, there's a lot for us to look at here, inside our organizations and the ways we're supporting fundraisers and to be really listening in I mean, I completely agree with you in terms of community first. And I also think, really listening deeply to the fundraisers on the ground and what they're dealing with and what they're faced with and what they need to, to be supported and safe doing the work that they're trying to do.

51:46  
And that ultimately ties back to one of the first things that we talked about, which is, where are we going, and Suhaila, you flagged this where the CEO can get slammed on Twitter, you know, or in this case, it's me, many times, I don't think my CEOs on Twitter, but like I am, and people are gonna be able to contact and say, We want change, we don't like this, please change this, there was actually even twitch, for instance, they changed their policy at TwitchCon on masking, because people leveraged the user voice community voting platform that's typically used for functionality. And so there's a brand new world of democratization and access that like, I don't think that a lot of people either realize is coming, or that tech companies realize that they're going to be beholden to these types of things a lot more.

52:43  
And I want to add to very quickly that I think, in order to be effective in our diversity, equity, inclusion, freedom and liberation goals, we have to have technology platforms be, we have to have the number one recognize and be held accountable for how they are contributing to toxic societies. Right. So, you know, it's, it's, I think, it's always a lovely thing, when I see or companies reaching back out, answering and solving some of the solutions, not for the benefit of their bottom line, but directly for the benefit of the people. And so sometimes that means that they're enacting programs that bring in these black and brown organizations to help them to help bring them up to speed, maybe with how to use these platforms free of charge. And to me, like, you know, getting the financial barrier out of the way is one of the first ways that we can make take action. And we've been saying this for years, over and over and over. And so I feel like at this point, a lot of platforms, you know, kind of have to get out of the out of the woods on making more money and deeper into building a better connection with how to support the organization instead of utilizing that tech against them.

54:11  
Okay, so we have a few minutes left. And so one I'm Nan, I'm going to answer your real quick which is, which is because I want to do that and then do a quick roundup at the end. Kim, I am writing out we have you covered on crypto, by the way, November, it's already done. So rock and roll there. We use social media for marketing, but the founder refuses to consider using it for development building our donor base. Any suggestions? And I think I don't want to gloss over this one. But I think we we did Mallory you touched on that for that executive buy in, in my opinion, you got it and we both both you and Suhaila I think got into it because it's like you have to show the value of why this is important. Because they're going to they have their list of things that they're going to be doing and it's very important To you, you have to show it to and it's you want the onus, in some ways is on you to show this is important for us. Please do this. And I'm going to make it easy. I ran into this this morning, I sent an email last night to my executive team. And I was not clear. And they were like, What are you asking us to do here and like, that's the thing, you got to make it very clear when, especially when you go up in higher in leadership in your organization, their brain is all over the place. And technology is not the thing that they're necessarily thinking of. But

55:33  
I would just add one other quick thing, which is that, you know, one of the things maybe I'm reading between the lines here is that the communication that you use on social media for your clients is perhaps very different than the communication you're using for your donors. And so there's this conflict here around around that. And that's a much bigger conversation, and it ended but I think there are ways to have community centric posts on your social media that are engaging to donors to there's this amazing organization, culture, aid, Nola, you can look them up on on Instagram or something there, there are really incredible example of an organization that has built tremendous grassroots community, with with donors, and people receiving food through their services and volunteers, this really amazing web network. And they they have a lot of word choice and language examples of ways to have really inclusive posts. And I think perhaps, maybe if your executive director could see could see that what it would look like, because maybe they're envisioning the type of emails that are going out to donors, and they're like, that doesn't belong on social media. And they might be right. So like, what does belong there in a way that creates that safety for the clients were used to digesting information from you that way and might still be able to engage donors in some of that communication.

57:01  
So we're coming up to the end of time, I want to be respectful of people's time, I'm gonna ask to two things one of the crowd. Okay, what did we not touch on that you want to hear more about technology, we didn't get into accessibility for for disability, for instance, we didn't get into detail to open click through rates and emails and things like that. So go to town on the chat and throw out a bunch of ideas because we can cover them. Kim, for instance, brought up crypto, we got you covered actually on crypto to Mallory and Suhailah. What is a intention that we can put out for people to basically go okay, like, I can do this. And this is how I can actually do this like today, when it comes to technology, like what is a good takeaway that somebody can have where they can come out of this and go, I got this I didn't put that in our pre list.

58:06  
There is one specific thing that I think is always important is that I literally had as a Hey, make sure you this is a takeaway. One thing that I want a lot of organizations to know too, is that there are a lot of tech grants out there that do support not only the purchase, but the integration of of different technology for your organization. And so when it comes to that cost barrier, as you're looking for grants that may support your programming, I will always encourage you to look for tech grants. Additionally, because they they really come in handy. And they do help us cover the costs for at least a little while. For the platforms that are hopefully help us scale. And then in terms of what I would like to see organizations do is I always encourage organizations, of course to build that build the their relationship with technology into their strategic planning, but also build that wish list alongside of your strategic planning that says, Okay, this is what I would like to see us be able to utilize, because I think that a lot of right now a lot of companies are listening. And if ever I'm running into an issue with the platform, I'm definitely reaching out to them to say, Hey, this is what we're needing right now. Can you you know, make sure that to include this and maybe your next update. And you know, sometimes they're like, Yeah, okay, whatever. But I have seen a few different times where platforms have gotten back to me and said, Hey, we were able to turn over what you were looking for. And this is how you can utilize it. So don't be afraid to reach out and connect where it's necessary. And follow the money trail when it comes to finding those grants that help you cover the cost of these platforms.

59:48  
And we're gonna we're gonna make sure that we provide contact information for our panelists, by the way, but Mallory, why don't you and end us with your thought and then we'll We'll share out how to contact people, Mallory's already doing some stuff there.

1:00:04  
I didn't know how to share with you guys the hourly fundraising rate thing as quickly as possible. So I just You just get a link. I haven't written it yet. But there you can see sort of the breakdown my takeaways to calculate that for yourself to just have some idea. It's so hard. There's so much shiny object syndrome in this sector, and we're constantly moving from thing to thing to thing, taking a step back and really trying to understand what are you needing to raise per hour of your fundraising is going to help you make really much more informed tech decisions around how to optimize your time, but it's also going to help you make other decisions. I did this with an EV the other day on a call. And she was deciding about whether she should do this t shirt sale. And she her hourly fundraising rate is like $320 an hour when we did what the t shirt sale was the year before it was 1125 an hour. So it was very clear, we should not be doing the t shirt sale again this year, there weren't other objectives being hit by it. So really, I think this, this framework can be really helpful. That's my number one takeaway to do today.

1:01:03  
Awesome. And through that, you can also connect with Mallory on LinkedIn, if you'd like to Suhailah if you want to drop in how people can contact you as well. Or, you know, for us, it's neon one.com. You know that? So there we go. Awesome. Awesome. Well, I'm so we can obviously talk about this so much longer. But yeah, that was that went by quick, I'm going to be honest, that went by a lot quicker than I thought, folks, this was fantastic. Thank you so much. Please connect with our speakers on LinkedIn. Both of them are awesome on social media, I love following them, as well. They have great content, insightful content. And hopefully, we'll also see you folks at generosity Exchange, which both of our presenters have been either involved with in the past or are involved this year. And so that's where you can kind of go and register for that. It's rock and it's coming up in a few weeks. And it's going to be a great way to get accessible, affordable and insightful direction on technology. So hope to see you there. Thank you so much. Thank you for this. Any final words before we sign off?

1:02:27  
Yeah, just stay in contact everybody. If we had like we were building our own community. So please do reach out if you have questions or are, you know, interested in learning more about some of the grants that I was considering? So please do reach out.

1:02:41  
Yeah. Thank you for having us.

1:02:43  
Thank you. All right, folks. We'll see you soon. We have other great items coming up. We just actually launched our Giving Tuesday Resource Center. So we're going to be shifting into giving Tuesday mode for a little bit of execution side here over at eon one, as well as generosity exchange. So have a great day. It's only it's Thursday. Have a great Thursday and so out of it, and we'll see y'all soon. Have a great day, folks. Thanks again to our panel.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai